Jacob* B/W Fleming (1744/50-1818) b. Europe or Shrewsbury, Monmouth/Middlesex Co., NJ; r. Dover, Monmouth Co. or Northumberland Co., PA (parents possibly Joseph & Christiana Fleming; Farmer)
-burial: unknown
Sarah Sytje West (1750-1788/9) b & r Shrewsbury, Monmouth Co., NJ (daughter of James & Ann Wing West; Homemaker)
-burial: probably Monmouth Co.,NJ
Wedding: 1772, Shrewbury, Monmouth Co., NJ
Children: most born in Shrewsbury, Monmouth Co., NJ
1. James (1773-1857) r. Pekin, Tazewell, IL
2. Joseph (1773-1828)
3. Stephen W(est?) (1775- ) did he die in childhood? Was there a Jacob too who may have died in infancy? Some sources say so. Often names were reused, especially the father’s name.
4. Jacob (1777-1855) One source has this Jacob born in 1788, the last child
5. Sarah (1779-1846)
6. John West (1781-1828)
7. Steven West (1783- )
8.Lawrence Carlysle* (1784-1862) b. Monmouth or Middlesex Co., NJ, or Derry Twp., Northumberland Co., PA; r. Sugarcreek Twp., Venango Co., PA (m. Margaret Cooper-our line)
-burial: Forest Chapel Cemetery, Sugar Creek twp., Venango Co.
*This is possible parentage based on secondary documents & internet discussion. Research is ongoing. Recently, New Jersey court records of around 1780 suggest that Lawrence Carlysle may have belonged to a William, Samuel, or Andrew. See comments under Fleming Tree and other Vitals. Below is the current narrative from FindaGrave.com.
Documentation:
Various Public Member Family Trees & documents. 11 July 2014. Ancestry.com
RETURN TO OUR FLEMING FAMILY TREE
Captain Jacob Fleming (1750-1818) from FindaGrave.com
Jacob Fleming was born November 1750 in Shrewsbury, New Jersey (Monmouth County)(Manasquan Borough), son of Joseph Fleming and Christian (maiden name not yet known).
In about 1773, Jacob married Sarah ‘Sythe’ West, who was born May 25, 1750 in Shrewsbury, New Jersey (Monmouth County)(Manasquan Borough), daughter of James West and Ann Wing.
Jacob and Sarah had six children: James Fleming, Stephen West Fleman, Jacob Fleming, Sarah Fleman, John West Fleman, and Joseph Fleman.
Jacob fought in the Revolutionary War and is listed in the records of the Daughters of the American Revolution (DAR) under Patriot number A040619.
Jacob died November 29, 1818 in Dover, Monmouth Co., NJ, and is buried in Christ Churchyard, Shrewsbury, Monmouth Co. Sarah was provided for in Jacob’s will.
A very old family Flemons Bible now in my possession suggests that Jacob and Sythe were both buried in Christ Churchyard in Shrewsbury. I am relying on this information until and unless I find information to the contrary.
Family Members (some question)
Parents:
Joseph Fleming
1730–1776
or
Christian Waldron Fleming
1732–1779
Spouse:
Sarah West Fleming
1750 – unknown
Children:
James Fleming
1773–1857
our Lawrence is not listed
Information by Nancy Ladd (46501834); sponsored by Shelley Fleming (48178327)
Last revised: 2/3/21
Thanks for the website. There is no evidence to my knowledge to suggest that Lawrence Carl, or Carlisle, is a child to Jacob Fleming. Although this misinformation has been proliferated on the internet, none of those posting it can offer a primary source. Jacob’s will does not mention a Lawrence. If someone has a primary source, please tell me! (I do not count “Ancestry.com” or “so and so’s website” or “my friend’s family group sheet” as primary sources.
Hello Tom,
I have communicated with you privately, and more recently have qualified the posting you refer to above. Thanks for your word of caution and inspiration. I’m revisiting my sources and will report any new findings, if any of us have any. Regards,
Larry
Recent DNA sample from a female descendant of Lawrence Fleming’s son, Barton, proves tha she is a descendant of Margaret Young, who married Robert Fleming, in Argylshire, Scotland. They came to America about 1867, and by the 1780’s lived in Northumberland County, PA.
We are still determining which of their sons is the father of Lawrence Fleming, b. 1784.
Aloha Tom and Larry,
Does this “qualified” posting mean that Jacob B. and Sarah West Fleming really are
Lawrence Carlysle Fleming’s parents? I am very new to genealogy and am sure I can get a lot of info mixed up. I would appreciate any help you can give. I know for a fact LCF was my ancestor.
Mahalo,
Kathleen Fleming Paik
Hello Kousin Kathleen,
I take it that you’re from Hawaii? Who is Tom that you refer to? In researching Lawrence Carlysle Fleming via Ancestry over the weekend, it seems that our genealogists are evenly split over his parents: half Lawrence Albert Fleming (1764-1784)/ Carol Squeaky (1764-1784) and half Jacob B(udman?).(b.1744) and Sarah West (1750-1789). Yet another possibility is Charles Fleming and Christina Chamber. All seem to have ties to Monmouth County, NJ, but Jacob and Sarah have off-spring named after them as does Lawrence Carlysle. At this point, sources are hard to come by. As one who has been at this on the amateur level for many years, I admit that I use “educated” guesses (in this case, secondary sources) and “qualify” like crazy. Please let me know if you find anything more, and thanks for your interest in our common ancestors.
Cousin Larry
December 26, 2016
Aloha Cousin Larry,
Thank you for your reply last month to my question about Lawrence Carlysle Fleming.
I apologize for this tardy response but I broke my arm and am just now beginning to use the keyboard comfortably. I am delighted to find another cousin. The “Tom” to whom I addressed my earlier memo was the author of a post just immediately before yours but do not know who he is.
Thanks for the information regarding LCF’s parents. This is certainly confusing. My original data came from Ken Gibbons, another cousin. He believed Jacob Fleming and Sarah West to be the parents. Unfortunately I have lost contact with him. Do you have any more information on Sarah West? I believe she came from Canada but have no proof.
Thanks for your patience. I wish you a lovely holiday season and joyous New Year from Keaau, Hawaii.
Kathleen
Reply:
admin says:
December 31, 2016 at 3:28 pm (Edit)
Aloha Cousin Kathleen,
In reading back over some letters, I see that “Tom” is the serious researcher who keeps us honest (See Fleming family tree page). I haven’t heard from Cousin Ken in many years. In checking old notes and new Ancestry.com I see that the Luton/Ritter tree has the most speculation about our Flemings and takes Sarah West’s parentage back to James and beyond. Have a look, if you are a member. That’s all I have for now. Enjoy the sunshine,
Larry
I am interested in Fleming/Flemmings also
My grandfather is a Fleming. Do you know if any of the Flemings in your article made it to Ohio? I have traced back to a Jacob Fleming, born 1819 in Ohio, and I am desperate to find his mother and father.
Caroline, I have not made the connection as I do only personal straight line family history at this site. However, your Jacob is only perhaps a generation beyond mine, and Ohio (you don’t say where in Ohio) isn’t that far from Venango County, PA. Also copying given names from generation to generation was a common practice back then. Keep searching, and let me know if you find that thread. Thanks for your interest.
Larry
Hi Admin,
I’ve been researching my ancestry for over a year now. I’ve made great progress on my
mother’s side of the family. But I have been frustrated trying to identify Lawrence Carlysle Fleming’s parents. LCF is my 4th GGF on my father’s side..
I’ve found a couple family trees that list Jacob Fleming and Sarah West. But most records do not include LCF in the list of Jacob’s children.
Any update on LCF based on your latest research?
Thank you.
Steven, unfortunately, I haven’t re-visited my Fleming ancestry in awhile and can’t add anything to your work. I’m wondering what the sources are for your family tree back to Jacob and Sarah. There’s at least one of my readers who adamantly believes that Lawrence is not their son. I hope I have at least noted the difference in opinions. I will e-mail you separately with some questions about our “cousinhood.” Thanks for your interest,
Larry
DNA has proven that Lawrence Fleming, b. 1784, is a descendant, likely grandson, of Robert Fleming, and Margaret Young, who came to Northumberland County, PA from Argyle, Scotland in the 1760s.